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Heidi Roizen

A DONE DEAL

SEASON 1      EPISODE 9

Ep 09 - Heidi Roizen - Entrepreneurship, Diversity, VC, and Investing

Chennakeshav Adya, Heidi Roizen

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Join Chennakeshav Adya, Managing Partner, in another episode of A Done Deal, a podcast where we get unique relatable perspectives on entrepreneurship and leadership as seen from the eyes of seasoned entrepreneurs and investors.

About Heidi Roizen:
Heidi Roizen is one of the most accomplished and seasoned veterans of the Technology game in Silicon Valley. She started out as a successful entrepreneur back in the 80's and 90's, and went on to become a senior executive at Apple; and in recent years, a Venture Capitalist, currently a partner at Threshold Ventures. She is the protagonist of an Organizational Behaviour case-study focused on networking and growth, taught at business schools across the globe. She is also a board member of various public and private companies, is one of the Top 50 Women in Tech among other many accolades.


"Beneath the surface is a special place. Beneath the surface is where extraordinary happens. Designations, visiting cards, fancy cars. Now, whatever may lie on the surface, delve a little deeper and that's where you will find the hunter gatherer, the predator. That's where you will find lurking, the real, way, way, way beneath the surface."

Chennakeshav Adya 00:49
Hello, and welcome back to another episode of "A Done Deal", a podcast, where we get unique relatable perspectives on entrepreneurship, and leadership as seen from the eyes of seasoned entrepreneurs, investors and executives. Our guest today needs no introduction. She is one of the most accomplished and seasoned veterans of the technology game in the Silicon Valley. She started out as a successful entrepreneur back in the 80s and the 90s and went on to become a senior executive at Apple. And in recent years, she's been a Venture Capitalist, currently a partner at Threshold Ventures. She's also been the protagonist of an organizational behavior. Case study focused on networking and growth taught at various business schools globally. She is also on the board of a few public and private companies and is one of the top 50 women in tech, amongst many other accolades. It is my great pleasure and an absolute honor to introduce my guest today, Heidi Roizen, Heidi, welcome to A Done Deal.

Heidi Roizen 01:55
Thank you So, much and thanks for having me. It's exciting to be here.

Chennakeshav Adya 01:59
So, Heidi, you've been a Venture capitalist for the last 20-odd years, you've been through the Dot-Com Bust, the financial crisis and now COVID. Is this the same? or different? What are the trends?

Heidi Roizen 02:13
You know, I could say it's both the same and different. I think there are elements that are the same. Anytime you go through something dramatic and this is, at least in my lifetime, the most dramatic thing I've ever been through, right. I've never been able to.... I've never not been able to leave my home and go shopping and do things like that at the time. We're speaking right now my county I live in is on what's called code purple, which means we're not even allowed to go to our offices or anything like that and we're really supposed to stay home as much as possible. So, and you know, our lockdown in California began in late March, and has been in various stages of lockdown since that time. So, I think that between the climate crises we've seen in recent history, particularly in California, with wildfires with the political upheaval that America has been going through, and then with COVID, we have never been in times like this. On the flip side, I think anytime there is a time like this. There are certain rules you can apply. Right?

When you don't you know, the crystal ball is cloudy, we don't know what it's going to look like. If you would ask me in March, whether we will be seeing all-time highs on the, you know, the Dow and all of that I would have said, “No way, the economy is going to be in a crisis.” And yet here we are sitting with these, you know, remarkable in these remarkable transactions. Again, this morning is the morning that the slack acquisition by Salesforce was announced the largest growth in software history in a long time. So, we're in almost the best of times, worst of times situation. But I think that entrepreneurs can always learn from the past. And particularly when it comes to companies that are venture backed to understand that when you're in uncertain times, the best thing you can do is protect your runway and understand how much capital you're going to need and how long that capital is going to last because markets dry up at any time. Even though again, even though they haven't, they've gone the opposite direction, since March. I still believe that particularly the way the numbers and statistics are going again here in the US in terms of COVID infection and the rise in death. Yeah, So, we are going through a couple rough months here. And So, if I were an entrepreneur, I'd still be very, very cautious about how I spend my money.

Chennakeshav Adya 04:35
Well, very true. One has to I suppose go through difficult situations to develop that resilience and in these unprecedented times of both using the word unprecedented and uncertainty. Many of us as investors as well as entrepreneurs are feeling rudderless and we don't know what to expect in the coming months. Some have us have never experienced an existential crisis like this before and COVID-19 has indeed thrown a spanner in the works for a number of people who are all set to get into the world of entrepreneurship, which on its own is really wild. So, what is your advice to entrepreneurs and founders on developing resilience? In addition to sticking to one's vision, amongst other things? How does one develop that resilience?

Heidi Roizen 05:32
Let me tackle two topics here, because you just you sparked one in my mind with the, with your opening comments. So, I'll talk about resilience in a second. But the thing I will say is, most great companies are founded at times when there is some form of change, right? That could be the new technology, whether that was broadband, or mobility, or whatever, back in my day, that CD ROM the hard drive I that's how old I am. And new technologies enabled new types of business models to exist. For example, a huge change with the advent of the Internet was the freemium business model, because before that, you ship software in boxes, and they cost money and So, that enabled entrepreneurs to do things they were never able to do before. If you look at the upside of COVID, and I don't mean to diminish COVID. at all, it's been a terrible, terrible thing for the world.

What it has forced people to do, though, is come up with new ways to do things. Everything in most people's lives has changed, how they go to go to work, how they seek their entertainment, how they educate their children, how they bank, how they shop for products, how they are entertained, it's all changed. And it's all gone to a virtual what we call a virtual first environment, at least for the near term. Some of those habits are not going to change when the world goes back to normal, because actually, it's easier to do certain things this way or it's more effective to do things certain ways, or it allows for different lifestyle choices when you do things a different way. And So, I actually believe that 2021 is going to be a golden year for entrepreneurs to capitalize on this, you know, cataclysmic change of how vast swaths of the world population are going to do things.

So, I think it is a great time to be an entrepreneur. In terms of resiliency....... I mean, there is one thing that's true about all the great entrepreneurs I know, and I'm sorry to say this, none of them have normal, balanced, easy lifestyles, right? entrepreneurship, I joke, I teach entrepreneurship at Stanford, and I joke, it's like a disease. I say, you become an entrepreneur, when you can't not do it, when you are just So, convinced that your idea is world changing, that you can't sleep, you can't eat, this is this is your life, your life becomes your company as it was for me in my early days as an entrepreneur and So, resilience, and especially in this era becomes that much more difficult. Because I do believe people are best when they have three.... more legs to your stool, you know, your life. If you only have one leg to your stool, which is you as an entrepreneur, if that breaks, your whole life breaks. If you don't have friends, family, community, religion, if that's something that's important to you, if you don't continue to nurture things, other than just your entrepreneurial endeavor, you don't have things to fall back on when the world gets roughened inevitably, the entrepreneurial journey is an extremely rough one.

So, I do believe that that resilience of not only community, but also personal care, this idea that you do have to eat, you do have to sleep, you do have to get exercise, I am a very...... I meditate 20 minutes twice a day, I think that's been I started four or five years ago with TM and that's been a really life changing thing for me, I think any form of meditation or finding a way to steel and quiet your body in your mind is very, very important. I wish I had done that. When I was an entrepreneur. I'm afraid I wasn't as enlightened as the entrepreneurs of today are but I think those are all ways that you can develop resiliency. And I think the last point that is a couple trusted, as I call them, fellow travelers, people who are experiencing the same thing at the same time as us. So, finding other entrepreneurs who are willing to talk to you, who are willing to get that phone call from you at 11 o'clock at night when you're furious at your investor or your co-founder and you just need to blow off steam and you need someone to talk to. That's really important. And the more you can find fellow travelers, people who are experiencing something similar So, that they can really have a level of empathy and even advice that you may not get, you know, from your mom, the better I think you're going to be able to do.

Chennakeshav Adya 10:09
Yes, you're absolutely right. Having such people in your life does make that difference and yes, they're called mentors. They're often rebranded as advisors, board members, on your startup plain, well in whole plain vanilla mentor's guide, a free resource, amongst other things but again, in the grand scheme of things, how do you separate the wheat from the chaff? I remember, you're a part of a case study, a very famous one, something I studied at LBS back in the day, one particular phrase caught my attention, and that was "Mentor Capitalist". Do you mentor people outside of your portfolio companies as well? Or how do you decide who to mentor either assigned?

Heidi Roizen 10:56
It's a little bit of a challenge given that my job is to mentor people. So, it's hard to do a lot of extra. My main focus for mentorship is our portfolio and particularly the people in the six companies on whose boards I serve. Secondarily, or I guess, primarily also, in that in that tier of commitment is my commitment to the Threshold Venture Fellows Program, which is a program that we run at Stanford University for master's students in the in engineering. Okay, we have this year, we just selected our cohort, we have 15 students, and I co teach that with Professor Tina Seelig at Stanford, and we put the students through a six month, fairly intensive. It's a seminar series and a lecture and discussion series on entrepreneurship and we really try to build community among those 15 students and so, those are my primary ones.

I am almost willing to take a meeting, you know, a lot of people contact me for mentoring and for advice and I think it's partially because of the case, the case is very popular and it's kind of funny, because every time the case is taught, I'll get like 200 LinkedIn requests from a particular school, and I'll know "Oh, it got taught there." And very often, I'll also do, as I've done with both LBS... ISB, Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, just all those are ones I've done in the last, you know, year or two, I often speak via zoom, or some other format, that allows me to be remote to those students and So, one on one meetings is quite hard, because if I, I could fill up all day, every day with one on one meetings and I can't really do that. But I do try to at least answer if someone emails me. And if they have a specific question, or they're wanting me to forward their resume to one of our portfolio companies or something like that, I certainly try to be helpful, I think it's a you know, pay it forward thing that one can do and then honestly I have some women entrepreneurs in particular, both male and female, but I particularly have some women entrepreneurs that I've met through my career, who I have become a loose advisor or mentor to simply because I had the experience myself and So, I have a collection of people that I have no official relationship with, but they're people that I've..... they've attached themselves to me or I've attached myself to them.

Chennakeshav Adya 13:31
Okay, and what mentors have been formative to your career and life?

Heidi Roizen 13:40 I've been very fortunate, I've been very fortunate, I would say, I can put them in sort of a couple buckets. One was, my father was an entrepreneur.

Chennakeshav Adya 13:47
Okay.

Heidi Roizen 13:48
And not always a successful one, by the way, he went through bankruptcy when I was, I think in junior high. Right. But he believed in entrepreneurship as a as a lifestyle choice. And that was very helpful, because I think I see it and particularly in cultures. I'm born and raised in Silicon Valley. So, I am in a weird culture I've seen in other cultures, that entrepreneurship is not admired and is in fact, not a good...... Parents don't want you to do it. All right. It is discouraged to be an entrepreneur, I was very fortunate in that my father really believed the best way to live one's life was as an entrepreneur, I remember him saying me,

"Why would you ever want to work for another person?
Why wouldn't you want to work for yourself?"

And he always was, from, at least the time that I was born and able to observe him he always made his money as an entrepreneur and as I said, not always successfully, but ultimately, he was able to build the lifestyle he wanted, without having a job.

And so, he supported that in me, and when I and my brother decided we wanted to start a company, he was very...... My family was very supportive of that. They didn't think it was weird that I would graduate from business school and get a job that didn't pay me. We weren't sure we were going to make any money. When my student loans were piling up and all of that. So, you know, I didn't come from a wealthy family. So, to my father was number one. Number two, I was very fortunate to, you know, be born and grew up in the era of early personal computing. And I got to work very closely with people like Bill Gates and Steve Jobs and those are my era compatriots. And someone said to me, "Well, how did you get to know a person like Bill Gates?" And I said, "Well, I met him when Microsoft had 27 people", because one of my good friends from undergrad ended up going to Microsoft. So, I met Bill in 1983, or 84, you know, back when they're when Bill wasn't Bill. Yeah, so, I was very fortunate to have and I wasn't an explicit mentor relationship, I would say it was more that I was able to be at the table with the people who were defining technology, defining my era of what it meant to be a leader, a world leader, really in, in business and in technology. So, I was very fortunate and then I'd say the third leg and this goes back to the comment I made earlier about finding your fellow travelers. There weren't a lot of women in tech at the time who were CEOs, but I was very fortunate to meet one actually through Bill. Okay, I met a woman named Dan Winblad and is a pioneer as a woman executive. And as a woman, venture capitalist, she founded a company called "Open Systems" in I think, late 70s, she was successfully acquired, she became a Venture Capitalist. And she became both a mentor to me and a very close friend. When she formed her venture firm, Hummer Winblad venture partners, we were their very first deal in 1989, she invested in my company and So, I was super fortunate to have the rare woman entrepreneur slash VC as my investor and mentor. And So, I was able to find some, you know, both and as well as some other women who were forging trails, in entrepreneurship in venture capital and that became my group. Some people join YPO, I had my own network of fellow travelers, and that was very, very important to me.

Chennakeshav Adya 17:34
Okay, that's incredible. And, yes, you're right. In those days, I suppose you had to be there physically, to participate in those groups but these days with zoom with the internet, you can I suppose look for mentors pretty much anywhere. Right.

Heidi Roizen 17:55
Absolutely, and I think it is, again, another silver lining is, in a funny way, people are much more accessible.

Chennakeshav Adya 18:02
Yes.

Heidi Roizen 18:03
Because the expectation, you know, you can ask somebody for a 10-minute zoom call. And I think a year ago, that would have seemed odd, in a way, I don't know, at least to me, it would have seemed odd. And now it doesn't seem that odd. So, I think people are more accessible. People are not traveling, and So, they have more time on their calendars and are more wedded to their digital lives. And So, I think they're a little more approachable through LinkedIn, or email or, or Twitter or other places, you can find people So, yeah, absolutely.

Chennakeshav Adya 18:36
Yes. And I suppose they do the same forward. Any which way?

Heidi Roizen 18:41
Yeah, no, I mean, some of them do. Some of them. I know, for example, me. My LinkedIn is So, over run. I can't answer everything that happens to LinkedIn but I literally on LinkedIn, I say, "If you really want me email me and my emails really easy to find." I mean, if you Google my name, you will find my email and So, it's really not hard to find me and I think a lot of people are pretty easy to find. I also think, again, for looking for mentors, everyone things I recommend to students, when I speak about my case is go on LinkedIn, find someone who graduated from the same school as you, who's five years ahead of you in a career that looks interesting to you, and reach out to that person because you have a bond, you have an alumni connection that gives you an entree, and to be able to say to someone you look like the who I want to be five years in the future. Would you be willing to spend 20 minutes on the phone with me explaining your career path and giving me some tips? Most people are going to want to be helpful to to someone who writes an email like that. So, what's the downside? You send something like that they never respond. Who cares?

Chennakeshav Adya 19:49
Yes, that's literally the worst that can happen. Yes.

Heidi Roizen 19:53
That's right.

Chennakeshav Adya 19:54
Yes. It's is very good advice. Thank you. Thank you. On the light side what are your thoughts on pretty much anyone including 19-year old calling themselves as mentors these days? What I mean....

Heidi Roizen 20:13
You know the funny thing.... Here's the thing, I think the word mentor is an interesting word because it used to imply a more an older, more experienced person helping a younger, less experienced person, which is why I prefer the, the expression, fellow travelers, to me, a fellow traveler can be anyone, they can be older, they can be younger, they can have more experience, they can have less experience. And I like the idea of your relationships that are going to bring value to your life and your business life being more of the fellow traveler than the mentor. I think people should develop both. And I think you should figure out how to do that. But one of the things I again, I tell students is everyone has something to offer.

I've had some really funny situations where people have wanted my time and my advice and they've offered to do funny things like I gave a speech one time in in Cincinnati, and a woman came up to me afterwards. And she said, I really feel like you could give me some career advice. And I didn't have time to sit down with her for a half an hour and I said, I'm sorry, but I don't have any time on this trip. And she said, Well, how are you getting to the airport tomorrow morning and this was pre-Uber. So, I said, "Well, I'm going to take a taxi", and she said, "Great, I'll pick you up and drive you to the airport." Okay, So, she drove me to the airport. And we talked the whole time and by the way, she had to come get me at 6am. So, you know, but it was fun for me. I've had students, you know, again, I live very close to Stanford. So, I meet a lot of Stanford students. I had a student who wanted to get advice from me who was also a personal trainer and So, he would come and train me while he asked me questions. I've had babysitters, bartender, it is kind of funny, but definitely, there's always something you can do for someone else. Even one of the things I think that's fascinating is, I think that people in their 20s or even 30s are way more technologically literate than people like myself when it comes to things like social media and just things that as much as I've grown up in technology, my whole life, my daughter still laughs at me sometimes when I can't figure out what the right setting on my iPhone is and So, one time someone offered to do an audit of all my social media, and helped me make my settings more appropriate. So, I think you just need to be creative about what you can offer someone else.

Chennakeshav Adya 22:47
Yes. That's a fantastic way to look at things I must say. But I like the word fellow traveler, I'll start using that.

Chennakeshav Adya 23:02
There are various initiatives by various public and private companies. An example that I can cite is the #IamRemarkable initiative by Google, which looks at empowering women and underrepresented groups, celebrate their achievements in the workplace and beyond. There are other initiatives, which also target Junior ranks, and entrepreneurs. Based on your recent experiences, could you please share with us what you're seeing, both in the corporate world as a board member of public and private businesses, as well as founders, in your portfolio businesses?

Heidi Roizen 23:46
Sure, well, I mean, ESG, DNI, there's all sorts of current buzzwords around this, but the idea that we should be more diverse, more inclusive, and corporations should be a better member of their communities in all ways, and just not just maximize shareholder return. These are all movements and I am a big proponent of all of them and I don't think they're going away and I think that companies are more and more going to be held accountable. Just today, again, in the recent news, or yesterday, NASDAQ has suggested they're going to not list companies who don't have at least two diverse members on their board, at least one woman and either two women or a woman and a person who identifies in some form of diversity.

And So, on the one hand, I don't like quotas, on the other hand quotas, get things done and looking across the board. There are two really interesting moves in terms of DNI and proving that that one is moving in the right direction for equal pay and equal opportunity and I think it's amazing that those things are happening. I do think though, that we are can play a role in that. And, and there are So, many things in life where I think you may think the expression, think globally, act locally and the idea being if I have an idea, like diversity is important, I can, through my individual action, create diversity, for example, on the boards I'm on, whenever there's an open position, I try to field candidates, black Latinx women, LGBTQ, I try to come up with candidates and I do come up with candidates because there are many amazing candidates out there who could potentially fill that role. Because I want to make sure the applicant pool is reflective of broader diversity. It doesn't mean you can force diversity but you can ensure that that that is there. I do when you asked me earlier, if I do proactively mentor women, I do put on things like about six weeks ago, we selected 25 women, it was invited only we were selecting women, who in my mind are board ready. So, they are ready to serve on a public board. But they haven't been on one yet and I did a little hour-long boot camp for them about how to prepare, how to present yourself, how to put a board bio together.

Chennakeshav Adya 26:16
Okay.

Heidi Roizen 26:16
And now, I have 25 more resumes that I can put forth to those things, to those opportunities as they arise. I think that meant that members of diverse communities, when you're in a company, the best thing you can do is support the other people in your community. So, I give this example very frequently, is, let's say and I'll use a woman as an example because it's easier. That's my diversity.

Chennakeshav Adya 26:44
Sure.

Heidi Roizen 26:44
If there are two women in a room, and everyone else is male, the women have to figure out how to support each other because if you think it's a zero-sum game, and only one of you can be successful, you're not actually lifting everyone. You're not forging the path. So, one of the things I've suggested, and sometimes you can do this because you plan it ahead. But sometimes you just if you have this attitude, So, you're in a meeting and people are asking, they're expressing their views. And often it's hard for women to break into those conversations. If you're a what.... If I'm Heidi, and I'm in the room, and there's another woman named Ann in the room, I can say, "Excuse me", I'd like to hear what Anne things. And that empowers Ann that shows that I respect Ann and I'm giving him the floor, right? And enough and you can do that. Again, if you are a member of a diverse or even non diverse, right, if you want to make sure that diversity has a voice, give them the floor. Like that is such an easy move to do. But people don't do it. Right. And I think it's a really wonderful thing to do. And I think that this opportunity to form these loose networks to say to someone else, "How can I support you? Give me an action I can do that would help you raise your profile." And in return, here's one you can do for me, right. And I just think that we have to be more proactive about these things.

Chennakeshav Adya 28:15
I'm completely with you, could agree more. Especially with the diversity in terms of experience, in terms of upbringing, in terms of perspectives, towards life towards time towards integrity towards pretty much everything. It changes when you have lots of diversity, lots of people from different backgrounds, different geographies, working on the same thing together.

Heidi Roizen 28:45
And I think it's hard. I mean, look, I think we all grew up with our biases. We all grew up with our backgrounds. We all grew up with our experience set.

Chennakeshav Adya 28:52
Yes.

Heidi Roizen 28:53
And it is hard to break out of that I you know, very personal story. But I have a transgender non binary child and then learning about trans and non-binary was something that happened. That became very interesting to me because I love someone who is that right? My child and I've actually blogged about it, if you go to my medium, I blogged about my child and also, I my child mostly, but with a little help for me, but mostly it was sable, my child wrote something for trans Awareness Week about how to have a more welcome workplace for trans and non-binary people. Is that something I would have done if I hadn't had the first world? You know, the first the very direct experience of having a child identify as such, you know, probably I wouldn't have been as aware of it, obviously. I mean, I was very much more aware of it because of that. So, I think that that personal experience and as we have more diversity in the workforce, we will all have more experience with diversity in the workforce and So, it will make us I hope, more acclimated and inclined to be helpful in that regard.

Chennakeshav Adya 30:08
Yes, absolutely. well as in other parts of the economic world, you already know that gender disparity is commonplace, especially with regards to household data and the fact that women often are the ones who have significant spend the most amount of money in any household as high as 70 to 80% and the economic incentives for investors and VCs, to be more inclusive, and the economic mysteries for incentives for executives, as well, to be more inclusive is as massive. As a result, it is still quite unclear why this this potential for women, and diversity isn't really reflected in VC firms as well. Could you please share your recent experiences more focusing on the new VC world that you're seeing in the last?

Heidi Roizen 31:17
Sure, I mean, I'm seeing a lot of interest in, I'm seeing a lot of movement in this. Number one organizations like All Raise that are ensuring that young women are mentored and supported into Venture Capital, the NBCA has something called I think it's venture university where they have had a focus on racial diversity. And I see some grassroots small efforts that are starting to have an impact, I also think, again, individually in the firms. Firms are choosing to diversify their ranks. And who has the most power, this is, this is always the interesting comment in the world, if customers decided. When customers boycott a brand because of something, and their revenue is affected brands learn to change company, you know, companies with brands learned to change, I think the limited partner, the people who fund venture capital, when they start saying, We will not put money into all male, all white male organizations, you will start to see change. There are some limited partners, certainly, Melinda Gates has been one of them, you know, at the forefront of this, who she has proactively backed women led venture firms and first-time managers and So, she's made a meaningful difference in terms of in terms of supporting those groups. So, I think we're seeing a lot of change.

These things that go slowly, you know, venture formation and venture evolution and venture careers are slow. And I think sometimes you're more likely to see changed by new firms starting up as opposed to an old, firm changing, because at the end of the day, venture firms are largely... They are partnerships, which means a group of people come together and decide they want to work together and in the past, that was often people who knew each other from some prior environment, it was often tech, and they were often highly male dominated environments and so, I think the lack of, of gender and even racial diversity in VC was a manifestation of that. And not necessarily, you know, we should not assume mal intent, we should just assume, you know, just like startups, a lot of Stanford startups are started by the people who sat next to you on either side while you took computer science.

Well, if you're sitting in there with a bunch of guys, and then you go back to your fraternity where you're living with a bunch of guys, you start companies with a bunch of guys and that's kind of, you know, people do things with people they know. And So, I don't ascribe that to mal intent, I ascribe it to doing what's easy. And let's face it, entrepreneurs should do it's hard. We are seeing many more women at the helm of entrepreneurial companies; I would say in the last three years or so. I would say close to half, if not half of the companies that we have funded at threshold have had women CEOs, So, I have to go look, but I'm pretty sure I'm right. It's probably about 40%. And, and why is that? I think in a way it's because we have two women partners, but interestingly, Josh Stein, one of our male partners, has probably as the most female entrepreneurs. He is our enterprise SAS specialist and a lot of women have started enterprise SaaS companies and So, I won't say a lot, some awesome women started. In enterprise SaaS companies, like Launchdarkly, and Front and we have been fortunate enough to invest in those companies. But there are other women led companies that might... for example, my partner, Emily Melton, who focuses on healthcare. That's a company called Tia, which is led by two women founders in women's health care. And So, we're seeing more women entrepreneurs. Yes. And, and we're very fortunate to see them and be able to back them.

Chennakeshav Adya 35:28
Okay and what about women you see? What advice?

Heidi Roizen 35:35
I mean, again, where it is.... We're seeing more and more, as I said, "More women are breaking out and starting venture funds spinning out and start venture funds." Many women are developing higher profiles right now. I mean, my partner Emily Melton being one of them. Kristin green, there are a number of women VCs who have Alien Lee, cowboy ventures. Again, I could give you a long list of names. Yes. Again, anyone who's interested in this, I encouraged looking at the organization all raise, which is specifically around bringing more women in and lifting women into better roles and venture So, it is changing but I do see it more at the younger funds and as opposed to the really established older friends. But now the older funds, Sequoia has a female partner and Benchmark has a female partner at here are there are a number of female partners in it... Funds that did not have women at the partner level before are bringing women into those roles now.

Chennakeshav Adya 36:40
Okay, and what specific advice do you have for men in the industry to help address the lack of female representation in VC?

Heidi Roizen 36:52
Well, it is something I talk about a lot. I'm not anti-male. Hey, I have some mannerisms. My best friends are male, and I work with men all day long and I enjoy working with men and this isn't about putting men down and putting women to put women up. It's just about bringing women up to the same level and I think that many of the men and you asked me early on about mentors. I mean, one of the great mentors I had that I should have mentioned was Bill Campbell an absolutely phenomenal mentor, who brought So, many women. When you ask some of the most senior women in my generation, in the tech industry, women like Donna Dubinsky, you know, who was your mentor, it's going to be Bill Campbell and Bill was very proactive about helping women and ensuring women had a seat at the table and recommending women to roles and giving them his time and that made a difference.

And So, I think, for men, and I will say this, the men who are the most proactive, if I were to stereotype, I should, but I will say like when I write a blog post about "The importance of supporting women", the men I hear from, are the fathers of daughters. Because again, if they look at the world through the eyes of someone they love and they say, "My daughter is about to launch into this world and I want her to have opportunity and I don't want her to be victimized by a predator and I want her to feel comfortable in her workplace and I want her to be graded on her merits and promoted on her merits, I want her to get equal pay to a male with her same qualifications". And all of a sudden, what maybe they just never thought about before, becomes very personal to them, because they love someone who's facing that and So, I think that men.... I think just be open minded to the idea that by supporting women, you actually you know...... and when I particularly in entrepreneurship, right, I do think there are environments, for example, let's take investment banking, not to pick on investment banking, but I'll pick on investment banking for a second, investment banking, they hire 12 people right out of business school, they throw a bunch of raw meat in the room, and they say two of you are going to make it and 10 of you are going to have to find something else to do. Well, that's a zero-sum game and So, there is no incentive to help other people in that situation. Not all investment banks work this way but I would say investment banking, management consulting, there are a lot of places where it's sort of a zero-sum game to get the Primo jobs. So, they're going to audition a bunch of people. And they're only going to pick a few...

Chennakeshav Adya 39:37
For a reason, yes.

Heidi Roizen 39:38
Yeah, but that is the business model. Yes. And So, there's less incentive to help your cohort.

Chennakeshav Adya 39:44
Yes, that's right.

Heidi Roizen 39:45
In entrepreneurship the interesting thing is, the whole company has to be successful. Right? The whole company has to be successful. It is in your best interest to help everyone else in the company because if the company is successful, it will grow and everyone will have more opportunity and if the company is not successful, it will go out of business and no one will have a job and So, it's a very interesting dynamic, the difference between zero sum game some companies, and everyone.... the company needs to win companies and I find the cultures are very different in those companies and So, also recognizing that if you help other people, and it helps your company be more successful, you will also be more successful and also, it just feels good to be helpful. This is the other thing I think that we are....

"Humans are wired to be helpful."

and we enjoy being helpful. And especially in a time like this. And it is it is a, you know, it is a life reinforcing thing to do to be helpful.

Chennakeshav Adya 40:49
Well, absolutely couldn't agree more Heidi. And yes, it's all it's all about the good karma, right? At the end of the day.

Heidi Roizen 40:57
Absolutely.

Chennakeshav Adya 41:00
Life comes back to you, in more ways than one something you call....

Heidi Roizen 41:05
Well and if you read a lot of books on happiness, right? I got divorced about 10 years ago, and I read a lot of books on happiness at the time and I can boil happiness down to four words, and actually three, because two, it's the same word. Meaningful work, meaningful relationships and I think one of the interesting things again, about entrepreneurship is very often, "You form meaningful relationships through your meaningful work." Some of my closest friends are still the people I worked with, at tea maker, a company that we sold more than 25 years ago, and I'm still friends with the people that I worked with there, because we formed these intense bonds at the time.

Chennakeshav Adya 41:41
There was no competition between you. Your friends, aligned, doing things together?

Heidi Roizen 41:52
You know, there's often, there's healthy tension, even in a startup but again, it goes back to this idea of, you know, I don't know if this analogy works globally, but works in the US, right, you can be the best player on the field but if your team doesn't win the Super Bowl, you don't get to wear the ring. Right. And So, it's kind of the same thing with startups. If the company doesn't succeed, you have to go find something else to do. So, the best way to ensure that you're going to have a successful career is to lift everyone.

Chennakeshav Adya 42:26
Wow! Wow, that was really insightful. I don't think I'll ever forget meaningful work, meaningful relationships. [laughing]

Heidi Roizen 42:38
It's a great way to run one's life. Let me tell you.

Chennakeshav Adya 42:42
Yes, the Japanese have something similar, right. Ikigai? Which follows a similar Venn diagram sort of structure.

Heidi Roizen 42:53
"Mm hmm".

Chennakeshav Adya 42:55
Okay, phenomenal. I'm conscious of time as well, Heidi, and thankfully, we've completed just in the nick of time. Do you have a special message?

Heidi Roizen 43:06
You know, I do I have one closing comment I'm very compelled to make which is the following. "Nick! Nick, who? Hi, Nick. Heidi Roizen here. I hope now you are going to remember me." [Laughter]

Chennakeshav Adya 43:22
Oh, well, thank you. Thank you.

Heidi Roizen 43:26
It's an inside joke. I am hoping it landed.

Chennakeshav Adya 43:31
Heidi, thank you So, much, again, for setting time aside for the podcast. I'm truly grateful for your time today. I really enjoyed our conversation.

Heidi Roizen 43:40
I really enjoyed it too. You are the master at asking great questions. So, I appreciate it very much and really enjoyed the conversation. So, thank you.

Chennakeshav Adya 43:50
All right. Well, folks. That's all for today. In our episode in our latest episode of A Done Deal. Thank you for listening in and please do subscribe to the podcast on iTunes and Spotify. Signing off then and have a great day. Bye for now [Music]



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